Thursday, December 25, 2008

Selected quotes

While I was counting nationalities and ages on hookers.nl you sometimes notice other things when you work your way through the reviews. What follows are some selected quotes. Perhaps some people will find them interesting. And beware that the location are not always right; prostitutes often relocate. Concerning forced prostitutes, I find it striking that clients notice much more fishy things happening in window prostitution compared to clubs. And.... the comments are translated into English. Often observations made ae made years ago but these prostitutes still worked during the last year.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=190001
The Hague, Doubletstraat 42p k5, Martha
(Latin American woman, 42-45 years old)
September 15th 2008, 16:20All those Eastern European girls, they are so beautiful, but you are, before you know it, already outside. The number of Latina’s is decreasing in the Doubie, and nevertheless those were the girls, especially for the older walkers, like me, who didn’t look on the watch.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=78472
Amsterdam, Wallen, Dollebegijnensteeg 3-2, Emma
(Greek/Italian girl, 24 years old)
October 27th, 7:20The lady didn’t cooperate at all, didn’t want to be touched and during the blowjob there hardly was any pressure from her tongue and lips that could be felt. Obviously didn’t reach a climax.

So a total letdown, while I suspect that she is forced behind the window.

Still I want to know more of this.

October 27th 2005, 20:56She indeed is sweet and shy, say gentle. And very pretty. I therefore have fucked her deliciously. She really felt lovely. I believe she simply came, because she squeezed ‘him’ considerably, but nobody believes that anyway. The blowjob was reasonable. Enfin, in my opinion it wasn’t such a bad experience. Certainly not a turnoff.

(…)

Why put in a review that you have the suspicions that she is forced. You never know that obviously, so then you must not write this down. Even when you suspect it, because you can write this about all ladies on de Wallen. I don’t want to make a discussion from this.

January 11th 2006, 23:09Co-walkers, this woman must be avoided. In de kooi, in a secluded alley, she can merrily play her tricks. Obviously she couldn’t do that when she was opposite St Annedwars 26. See my earlier posts on this address.

The girl must be categorized with fat letters under TMM [‘Te Mijden Meid’, a girl that should be avoided]. She can be identified by her heavy bruise/birth mark on her right thigh. I couldn’t escape the impression that she does this work against her will and that she has troubles with it.

March 29th 2006, 22:21Certainly no Emma for me anymore, also her Italo boyfriend phoned her during the session, also not very beneficial for the atmosphere.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=10452
Wallen, Trompettersteeg 5-6, Gloria
(from the Czech Republic, Albania or Serbia, 26-29 years old)
March 11th, 2005 21:39Hmmm…… also had a true TMM-experience again. I had a horny liking into something ‘vulgar’. I already walked by Gloria’s window very often where she always greeted me warmly. So today I went inside… the plastic E-size

(…)

Super stereotypical experience. After entering her room her pimp/loverboy/but absolutely not her dad came rushing along to check if everything was OK. Indeed: it was a second generation fellow countrymen so to speak [Turkish or Moroccan].

(…)

The Russian [type of sex where the guy satisfies himself between the breasts of the woman] had as only ‘merits’ that I saw that the aforementioned fellow countrymen probably was named Saimir (tattoo). Blowjob: mechanical, she did do her best, but if you switch the sense button to zero in this profession the client should notice, or not????. Wham, the little mouth on it and go for it, so it wasn’t….

October 21th 2007, 12:10No experience with this girl, but she is simply not my type. Had to laugh out loud about her yesterday when I walked by and heard a part of a conversation with a tough young man who opposite to her in the alley leaned on a wall very relaxed.

[In English]
Guy (M): “Where are you from? Costa Rica?”
Gloria (G): “Who cares where I’m from! Come in and fuck me!”
M: “I’ll come in if you tell me where you area from…”
G: “What! You wanna fuck me or my country?!”

August 3th, 2008, 3:13Saw something awful this evening at Gloria. Beforehand I want to emphasize that I don’t know what exactly took place inside, but in my eyes there was something very fishy about what I saw.

I walked on the much too overtrafficked St. Annendwars when suddenly an alarm went off. Now, that happens a lot more often so I simply walked on and passed the Trompetter. After ten meters I suddenly heard a lot of noise behind me and turned around. I see like fifty people crowding together around the entrance of the Trompetter. I walk back to take a look (nothing voyeuristic is strange to me). I look over the crowd and see a number of prostitutes standing at the door of Gloria. The door was open and I hear a lot of noise. Then I see a glimpse of a bald head. Then I heard a number of hard blows and pounds. Then a man (app. 60 years old) is thrown out the door by the bald guy completely naked. The man stands up from the ground and clearly has injuries in his face and has a bloody nose. The bald guy immediately ran off (so brave are these fucking pimps aren’t they) like a thief in the night.

The man stands there with his hands before his crotch shaming himself immensely, while multiple tourists are loudly laughing and shouting and making pictures. After half a minute the door opens again and his clothes are thrown outside. I couldn’t bear to watch it any longer, but I couldn’t reach the guy through the crowd. I would have willingly put something around him to cover him, my coat or something. I just walked away. Those are a pair of eyes less which are watching him.

Again, I don’t know what happened inside, but one thing I do know: when everything became a little calmer again, I walked passed the window again and she stood there extremely aggressively swearing at tourists and making kicking movements. I have a very bad feeling about this lady and she willingly and knowingly brought in this bald guy. I’m convinced of that. Dangerous lady in my opinion, with even more unpleasant little friend.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=13069
Wallen, Goldbergersteeg 4, Vicky
(from Hungary, Bulgaria or Finland, 33 years old)
November 10th 2003, 14:52This Vicky is not Hungarian but comes from Bulgaria…. I took her home a couple of times after I started to have a conversation with her in a coffeeshop…. Then she told me she had a row with her (paranoia) friend and would go to Spain the next day…..

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=162939
Wallen, Molensteeg 4 left, Yvette
(Hungary, 18 years old)
June 29th 2008, 20:01A girl who works during the daytime and during the night, like many girls in the Molenstseeg .. I didn’t know it was allowed working 16 hours per day behind a window, phoning with your pimp every minute. Does it matter then how Yvette does it.. Yes when you have paid but the reason that she only sees an asshole with money so that she stands there day and night.
But yes if it interests anybody I wonder.

June 29th 2008, 21:28Also I have my doubts if this is all well, with this girl, only 18 years old.
She clearly looks worn-out, deeply in the sockets lying, dull eyes and actually too skinny…

July 3th 2008, 15:58When I came in she seemed to note down something. She notes down the next client I then thought. She made as short phone call. I gave her the money and undressed. Indeed blowing she did but kept her bra on. While I wanted to take it off she wanted to do it herself. Likewise it went with the panties. She seemed to do as little as possible. Then she lied down and looked at me with an expression which I could only interpret as painful. She did nothing herself and that gave me an uncomfortable feeling. She also looked as if it was something bad what I wanted to do, very unpleasant but I know it also can happen differently.
Obviously the lust to continue withered away. She put out her tongue at me. I asked if she was forced to do this. No answer and she suddenly spoke insufficient English.
I said to her in English that in my opinion she was in the wrong business and dressed myself up again. While I was dressing up there was some busy telephoning. While I was walking to outside there was some vehement spraying with a spray can as if I carried some nasty diseases with me.
I have the strong suspicion that she is probably forced to do this but plays along with the game and makes the best of it because obviously there are again and again new victims that can be scored among tourist and such.
A nasty experience for me but also for the lady in question I find this not good.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=193267
Wallen, Molensteeg 11 right, Lili
(Hungary, 22-25 years old)
November 20th 2008, 00:47A minus is that after coming she immediately stopped. Communication is limitedly possible, she speaks English badly. Like many young Eastern European girls she doesn’t really seem to experience enjoyment from this work, but luckily she was very friendly.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=193243
Wallen, Molensteeg 14, Annet
(Eastern European, 18-21 years old)
November 19th, 2008, 16:13She put off her panties when I was completely ready for it and [she] first went to make a phone call (I strongly got the impression that she had to let know that she had a client). During the visit it was also clear that she kept track of time.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=136638
Wallen, Molensteeg 2-3, Maria
(Hungary, 20 years old)
September 11th 2007, 23:36She was more talkative this time. She almost begged me to do it slower. That’s what I did, but it wasn’t really pleasant. I called it a day very quickly. After this, we have cuddled and talked for 45 minutes. She works already since she was 15 in Hungary and she’s here only since a couple of months. Really moving and unfortunate.
I really like her and she just doesn’t belong here. (…)

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=116122
Wallen, Molensteeg 4 left, Erica
(Hongarije, 22-25 years old)
August 21th 2008, 15:38As soon as the clothes went off she immediately started to make a phone call…? And also when the clothes went on…? Pimp I think...?

What happened in the meantime was hardly worth to mention except that it cost me 100 euros… I did came by the way but if it was up to her it wouldn’t have.

Clearly a TMM although I suspect that she is pushed in this position.

August 22th 2008, 15:17That she is pimped is also my suspicion, because when at any time you come in de Molensteeg, she always stands there.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=140003
Wallen, Molensteeg 4 links, Samantha
(Dutch, 22-25 years old)
December 23th 2007, 23:21Most of the time I find de Molensteeg not such a pleasant street (too many bragging Brits, fellow countrymen who spit on the street and/or whiggers, and sad Eastern European girls), but I found that the well-rounded Samantha looked sympathetic.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=104774
Wallen, Oudekennissteeg 2 links, Agaatha
(Belgium, 26-29 years old)
September 15th 2008, 19:05I hadn’t visited Agaatha for a very long time, I wasn’t really informed about her eventual holiday plans…
During my last visit I did notice that Agaatha had several bruises on her arm. I have never had any suspicions in a certain direction, with this lady…

Who knows more?

September 18th 2008, 00:36Saw her last week on de Oudezijds Achterburgwal 68 sous and this evening in the Oudekennissteeg 8, well those bruises who shall say, always seemed a very independent woman to me, but yes, if you should believe all those reports in the press you never know nowadays…..

November 13th 2008, 16:51Today I also got to know her. A lovely girl, and a real chatterbox….. and indeed still the bruises although she told that she worked entirely independently.

November 13th 2008, 21:30Don’t worry about her bruises, is caused by something else casu quo lesser experience. She works 100% for herself.

Also I initially didn’t have the suspicion that she works forced… However, those bruises that I spotted last summer in any case… doesn’t seem to be an incidental little accident…

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=105946
Wallen, Oudezijds Achterburgwal 51-1, Angela/Iva03
(Romanian or Italian, 24 years old)
May 29th 2008, 00:35And while I deliciously started she immediately said “you want ass?” Yes, also a bit fun and new for me, but while I was busy, she suddenly turned around to take her mobile phone, where she almost twisted my willie off, she simply starts to read the SMS she just received while I look around baffled what’s happening now.
Again “you want ass?” I thought I was already busy doing that, bitch…
Oh yes, and then made an end to it.
She coolly says afterwards “ass is 300 euro… .” What? I don’t understand, okay 200.
She blocks me the exit, I give her 50 euros extra to get out, she says, would you believe it: I call the police. Yes okay I said. She pushes two numbers, [the phone] gets a conversation tone or something, I wait but nothing happens, after 3 or 4 minutes she says okay, no problem, no problem, bye bye.
And I actually am allowed to go outside.
Draw your conclusion but stay away there.

July 12th 19:41While I stepped in she immediately asked for money okay so gave 50 and undressed but she kept her clothes on, except her panties she took off, well okay let it be, but once on the bed she started giving a blowjob badly, 5 seconds or so, then she said do you want anal, yes no problem if she proposes it herself, but when we had done that she suddenly said with a coarse voice I want 200 euro more you have taken me anally, I said in English that she should have told that?? Then she became angry we stopped and she said I want 200 euro?? I had no money with me anymore, at least, no 200 euro, she also asked me for my credit card, well I didn’t have that either at all, so I quickly got dressed, while she grabbed the telephone I quickly left, I was really pissed and felt deceived, while suddenly near the St Annastraat some pimp or another grabbed me by the collar, he said with an Italian accent you have fucked my wife, I want 200 euro within 2 minutes, I said I have no money with me anymore, he said give everything you got so I gave him 30 euro that was all I had. Then he was gone.

Watch out for this lady, unfortunately I don’t know her name but she looks sweet but once inside you are in complete trouble with her, she is a big imposter.

July 12th 2008, 20:39This swindler today stood on the Goldbergersteeg 8 again, and by the way, she also has some sort of pimp or whatever who keeps an eye on all her clients.

July 21th 2008, 13:43Pimp is no threat, he’s an old dick who tries to scare you, where I don’t give a shit about.

July 26th 2008, 12:23When I once more tried to make it clear to her that we agreed upon 100 euro and that she should have indicated it was too little from the start (like advance payment should occur) she began standing in front of the door like a spider and started to make a phone call with her mobile phone that there were (problems).
Now I don’t become frightened very quickly but I obviously don’t know what’s ahead of me after that phone call, by the same token 5 men and then it becomes nagging and by the way I don’t feel like spending a while at the police station.
So I hard-handedly removed the lady from the door and I made the best of a bad job.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=142427
Wallen, Oudezijds Achterburgwal 72 middle, Sylvana
(Italy, 23)
January 4th 2008, 11:32Most of the time I’m very wary of this but she was so convincing that I nevertheless decided to go inside. She told that she came from Italy and that she was from the mafia. I then said that therefore one has to watch out for her and that she acknowledged.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=65027
Wallen, Oudekennissteeg 2 left, Bonny
(Netherlands, 20 years)
May 7th 2006, 13:07In her room there’s a nasty little staircase (step) where you could easily make a wrong step. Perhaps it did happen to her once? From where else comes that vague bruise on her right eye socket…
Furthermore, before we started, she had to sms a little message.
I don’t want to insinuate anything, I do only observe. I hope that it is a clear story.

December 16th 2007, 12:46And that smsing also I asked if that was supposed to be a part of it, she answered with a story like “yes I have two little guys who collect money (pimps) so I have to keep them informed then one then the other so that they don’t know anything about each other you understand me” I didn’t understand anything about it and paid after that, and she brought me to the door and there I saw a very tall dark man with moustache who spoke to her and took money and he allowed her to go to her place with the next customer..
In my opinion she could better do her best with only smiling.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=52440
Wallen, Trompetterstraat 3-3, Rachel
(Netherlands, 22 years old)
March 26th 2007, 9:10There also was some bloke from the Eastern bloc in front of her door (a regular customer she said) so I decided to walk through the city centre for a little while.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=182275
Alkmaar, 2p, p4, Hainaka
(Hungary, 18-21 years old)
July 14th, 19:19The most “beautiful” part came when afterwards, after we were already dressed up and just as I was about to leave her room, she began to whine about 10 euro extra because I stayed longer than 15 minutes (according to her I went 5 minutes over the time) inside! I acted as if I was a little bit stupid, and then she went to phone her Hungarian boyfriend/pimp to ask how she could make it clear to me in English that I should pay 10 euro extra. That asshole of a guy screamed through the telephone: “10 plus, 10 plus” Then she penetratingly repeated this towards me. She simply insisted on it that I should pay her 10 euro extra.

(…)

To be short, this “lady of pleasure” is acting extremely stupid and won’t carry on for very long. I actually hope that this not so sincere lady has already left. This way there really won’t be a client who will return to here! Hopefully this surely is a warning in advance for all walkers!

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=152103
Alkmaar, 3p k25, Kitty
(Romania, 18-21)
October 17th 2008, 17:32In the border area of Romania and Hungary live at a lot of Hungarians. They have a Romanian passport but see themselves as Hungarian, that’s also what they speak. In the border area place-name signs are bilingual: Romanian and Hungarian. This area is a rich source of ladies for our street, I know several who come from there. Where Kitty comes from I don’t know.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=178851
Alkmaar, 3p, k8, Boriana
(Bulgaria, 20 years)
September 20th 2008, 14:03What happened then was really a bloody shame. I didn’t have my pants, socks and shoes yet on and she pulled open the curtains. Then it really became troubling…. After I made it clear to her that I wasn’t happy about this and wanted to close the curtains. Then the lady pulled the door open and started to scream, after which her Bulgarian pimp began to address me. I shouldn’t expect to be inside for two hours, while I was inside for ten minutes at most.

SO GENTLEMEN, AVOID THIS LADY... THEN SHE WILL BUGGER OFF ON HER OWN ACCORD!!
A WASTE OF YOUR MONEY, THERE ARE MANY BETTER ONES IN THIS NAUGHTY ALLEY. UNFORTUNATE THAT THIS SORT OF LADIES OBSCURE THE IMAGE OF WINDOW PROSTITUTION

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=79312
Alkmaar, A, Z1, Anita
(Hungary, 20 years old)
February 29th 2008, 10:26But Tuesday there was another lady in her room, judged from her last conversation she went back home and comes back in about 2 months.
You would never know but a number of times she has been approached aggressively and even beaten up by pimps.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=149187
Alkmaar, A13, k2
(Hungary, 30-33 years old)
February 22th 2008, 23:13In any case she works voluntarily.

February 23th 2008, 12:35I’m happy about that because a couple of times that I was with here I had the impression that this was not the case. Especially because it seems that with every new client she must phone her boyfriend/pimp (?). But perhaps that [the other client] has experienced this too and understood was she said?

Unfortunate that the sex was not great but as for the rest this girl is not that bad. She is actually quite friendly but you have to treat her a little bit with velvet gloves.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=3213
Utrecht, Zandpad 116-5, Vanessa
(Dominican Republic)
May 1sth 2002, 00:23I went in there with the agreement of 200 bucks for half an hour with blowing, fucking and licking. When I came in the phone went immediately. Her mother! I went to wash myself for a while and came back. She said her mom goodbye and put her phone away which immediately went again. I was supposed to lie on bed for awhile and make myself ‘hard’. Her boyfriend/pimp was on the line and he was screaming like hell, that’s why I could hear her name. And in the meantime she was making gestures that she didn’t understand and giving meaningless answers. After a period of this nagging the line was broken. I asked if the phone could go out or on ‘silent’. That wasn’t possible because the phone credit of her boyfriend was used up anyway.

(…)

And then that *#@!& telephone went again. Again that asshole of a boyfriend/pimp. So she steps into the shower (I was dressing myself long before in the meantime out of annoyance) and while she's sobbing she begins a conversation again with that bigmouth. She first did take the wallet with her and then unlocks the door so that you can go. I kept standing there and she gestured multiple times to leave.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=89416
Utrecht, Zandpad 118-4, Hai Fa
(Thailand, 26-29 years old)
June 23th 2007, 10:46Also this girl is really a hit, I already knew her from The Hague, I got her number then, we were to do an escort, then suddenly there was a call from her boyfriend (pimp) and we have never seen her again in The Hague !!!!!!

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=192617
1p, g2 k2, Angela
(Hungary, 21 years old)
March 9th 2007, 02:44She told me that she was somewhat tired. It couldn’t be caused by the number of clients that day: I was only the third after yet 4-5 hours of being present. But just as with most of the ladies she makes far too long days, each day of the week. Asked about why the fairly logical answer was that if she doesn’t work she doesn’t earn money. Those long days are also often mentioned as an example how the ladies are exploited. But also completely without compulsion most of the women do want their highly paid day shifts rent to be maximally utilized.

July 13th 2007, 03:21I fucked her fairly firmly, at least quickly – not very different than at other times I believe. Suddenly it was like: stop it. She couldn’t stand the hard pounding she said, sometimes she does, and she also didn’t like too softly, but this was much too hard. I immediately felt like a caddish barbarian. I then continued on as carefully as possible, but especially by her outbursts and the earlier feeling that it didn’t happen all too quickly for her, the fun was over for me. I said to her that I would finish it by hand, masturbated for quite a while, where she began too lie in a seductive pose for a while. I ignored it however and looked somewhat at the side towards the TV.
After 2 minutes I said this is not going to work, and I started to wash myself.
With a totally not understanding Angela; if I didn’t want to fuck her for a while, why etc tc.

Apologies, but these days everybody fucked hard she said. Later she said she had some pain (I said she should have told me beforehand), the day before somebody with a big one… had fucked her really hard. I explained to her that I wasn’t concerned with that she would indicate what she does or does not like today. But that I didn’t have the feeling that she was angry and impatient from the beginning and that her responses made her insecure (after all, nothing was right). And that I knew that I wouldn’t come anyway or it would take too long. She really took the effort to talk it out with me, ten “I’m sorry” ‘s, and that she was tired, that it was way too late for her, that I could better come in the afternoon. She apparently didn’t want to lose a client.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=87544
Deventer, Bokkinghang 20 t/m 24, Xenia
(Germany/Italy, 22-25 years old)
May 15th 2007, 01:04Behind the third window of the new segment stood a long and blond lady. Inside it turned out to be Xenia, half German, half Italian. Speaks good Dutch with a light accent. She has worked in German FKK’s, but she didn’t found it hygienic, because of kissing, eating pussy and fingering you only get infections.
She talks very nicely, but when you hear this you start to think “Why does it go wrong with all German ladies”.

June 21th 2007, 22:58I haven’t been here for precisely a year. I was tired of Deventer, not up to much and always a big question if the women, mostly foreign, are there voluntarily.
That I am a so-called walker I don’t find that bad, but I do want the lady to stand behind her choice of profession. And I believe that in Deventer there are mostly ladies who would rather have another job but who don’t have that choice in their own hand!!!! AND I DON’T WANT TO MAINTAIN THAT!

But well, I had the intention: I want to have sex this evening, with a delicious girl!
So I stepped into the car again and went to Deventer.
What I saw there surprised me! Almost every window was womanned and what was sitting there almost always looked good. With a number of them I did have the strong impression the their age was far below 20 and therefore ARE NOT THERE VOLUNTARILY!!!

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=165847
Club Sneeuwwitje, Rijksweg 32, Herten, Linda
(Eastern European)
April 20th 2008, 02:24She had to sniff her nose all the time. I thought o mucus! So I asked do you have a cold. No she said it’s because of those damn drugs. Sad I thought. But it turns out to be normal there. And then it all came loose. That dirty old gray man (owner) with his Polish **** as I would call it in this case. He is only after 1 thing and that is money, money and even more money. The girls who work there work illegally, they have no sofie number or nothing. And also they are induced to use drugs. Of the 185 euro that I had to pay for, for one hour, she only got 80 euro!!! I said that doesn’t make sense at all. I don’t understand that x still walks around there. She is worth more. Only very unfortunate that it is those drugs again that ruins it for such a beautiful girl. I told her that she must go searching for another club then. Because this is going nowhere. Those girls simply don’t go because they don’t dare to I believe. They were being barked at everyday. By that guy. Even where I was standing!!! In my opinion this is intolerable. And hope that one day they raid this place and lock this guy up. But okay, that won’t happen I think. UNFORTUNATELY. And I hope that the girls can start working somewhere else or something. This is really a place to forget. They won’t see me here again.

http://www.hookers.nl/showthread.php?t=194688
Roermond, Heinsbergerweg 230, Club Yin Yang, Ascha
(Eastern European, 18-21 years old)
December 15th 2008, 11:44I first licked her deliciously until she got a true orgasm, and that was really not fake. I still had my boxershort on, but yes, the little bear almost jumped out. First some heavy French kissing and in the meantime she was jerking me off a bit. After this, a little blowing without condom and rather deep every now and then until the point of gagging. A horny sight at that moment. I indicated that I was about to come and wanted to take it out of her mouth but that wasn’t going to happen. She continued to blow me with deep thrusts, then she said that I should jerk off and come in her mouth and onto her face. This was real porn…..

Monday, December 22, 2008

Club prostitutes 2005

I counted 1343 club prostitutes in 2005, of whom 1132 a nationality was mentioned. Also here I have to add that I didn't record the dates of observation, so also observations from 2002 to 2004 are included.

Groups (I didn't record the group under which the prostitutes were categorized by hookers.nl. The groups "Northern Africa", "Western countries" and "Middle East" are not used by hookers.nl):
11,243%: Eastern Europe (of 64,238% of the women a nationality was named)
4,319%: No Group (0%)
1,862%: Africa (32,000%)
2,085%: North Africa (100%)
49,442%: Netherlands (100%)
6,701%: Western countries (100%)
3,127%: Southern Europe (47,619%)
8,563%: Asia (84,348%)
0,670%: Middle East (100%)
11,988%: Latin America (73,292%)

The nationalities mentioned (I also mention percentages in which I assume that prostitutes of whom only the group was mentioned have the same characteristics as the other prostitutes in that group)
664 (51,673%): The Netherlands
66 (6,089%): Thailand
48 (5,815%): Poland
53 (5,628%): Surinam
61 (4,747%): Germany
32 (3,398%): Brazil
16 (1,938%): Russia
24 (1,868%): Morocco
23 (1,790%): Belgium
19 (1,753%): Indonesia
15 (1,593%): Dominican Republic
9 (1,471%): Spain
6 (0,981%): Greece
7 (0,848%): Lithuania
6 (0,637%): Colombia
8 (0,623%): Turkey
5 (0,606%): Bulgaria
5 (0,531%): Venezuela
3 (0,490%): Portugal
2 (0,486%): Liberia
2 (0,486%): Ghana
4 (0,485%): Czech Republic
4 (0,485%): Hungary
4 (0,485%): Yugoslavia
5 (0,461%): China
3 (0,363%): Romania
3 (0,363%): Ukraine
2 (0,327%): Italy
3 (0,319%): Netherlands Antilles
3 (0,277%): India
1 (0,243%): South Africa
1 (0,243%): Nigeria
1 (0,243%): Cape Verde
1 (0,243%): Angola
2 (0,242%): Slovakia
3 (0,233%): France
2 (0,185%): Philippines
2 (0,156%): Tunesia
2 (0,156%): Egypt
1 (0,121%): Latvia
1 (0,106%): Jamaica
1 (0,106%): Mexico
1 (0,106%): Cuba
1 (0,106%): Argentina
1 (0,092%): Pakistan
1 (0,092%): South Korea
1 (0,078%): Denmark
1 (0,078%): Finland
1 (0,078%): Wales
1 (0,078%): Syria

The ages (mentioned by prostitutes and guesses by clients [but not including estimates mentioned in the review forms])
248 club prostitutes
average: 27,494 (SD=6,890)
younger than 18:0,403% (?, at least, that's what a client thought)
18-23: 31,048%
24-29: 36,694%
30-39: 24,597%
40 years or older: 7,258%

27 Eastern European prostitutes
average: 27,500 (SD=6,021)
18-23: 22,222%
24-29: 48,148%
30-39: 22,222%
40 years or older: 7,407%

35 Latin American prostitutes
average: 26,554 (SD=5,931)
18-23: 37,143%
24-29: 34,286%
30-39: 25,714%
40 years or older: 2,857%

106 Dutch prostitutes
average: 27,637 (SD=7,489)
younger than 18: 0,943% (?, you know I included estimates)
18-23: 31,132%
24-29: 36,792%
30-39: 21,698%
40 years or older: 9,434%

Back to 2008 to have some comparison material (also age mentioned by prostitutes and guesses by clients [but not including estimates derived from review forms]):
309 club prostitutes (2008)
average: 29,210 (SD=7,957)
18-23: 28,803%
24-29: 32,039%
30-39: 26,861%
40 years or older: 12,298%

71 Eastern European prostitutes (2008)
average: 26,476 (SD=6,420)
18-23: 36,620%
24-29: 39,437%
30-39: 18,310%
40 years or older: 5,634%

37 Latin American prostitutes (2008)
average: 29,917 (SD=7,860)
18-23: 21,622%
24-29: 32,432%
30-39: 32,432%
40 years or older: 13,514%

117 Dutch prostitutes (2008)
average: 29,436 (8,040)
18-23: 34,188%
24-29: 22,222%
30-39: 32,479%
40 years or older: 11,111%

Window Prostitutes 2005

Here I give some numbers from the past (2005) to make some comparisons with now (2008). Unfortunately I counted differently at that time. I didn't record the times of observations, so also some observations from 2002 through 2004 were counted.

I counted 1481 window prostitutes in 2005. Of 1039 window prostitutes the nationalities were mentioned. Unfortunately I didn't often record the group under which the prostitutes were categorized by hookers.nl, except where no nationality was mentioned.

The groups "Northern Africa", "Western countries" and "Middle East" are not used by hookers.nl.

23,228%: Eastern Europe (of 51,744% a nationality was mentioned)
3,309%: No group (0%)
3,106%: Africa (47,826%)
1,350%: Northern Africa (100%)
22,957%: The Netherlands (100%)
6,955%: Western countries (100%)
8,103%: Southern Europe (69,167%)
5,807%: Asia (86,047%)
0,473%: Middle East (100%)
24,713%: Latin America (57,923%)

The nationalities mentioned (I also mention percentages in which I assume that prostitutes of whom only the group was mentioned have the same characteristics as the other prostitutes in that group)
340 (23,743%): The Netherlands
56 (6,751%): Dominican Republic
42 (5,668%): Poland
39 (5,263%): Czech Republic
64 (4,469%): Germany
53 (4,301%): Thailand
34 (4,099%): Colombia
40 (4,039%): Spain
32 (3,858%): Brazil
31 (3,737%): Surinam
19 (2,564%): Russia
21 (2,532%): Venezuela
18 (2,429%): Bulgaria
17 (2,294%): Hungary
20 (2,019%): Italy
20 (2,019%): Greece
10 (1,460%): Ghana
10 (1,350%): Ukraine
15 (1,217%): Indonesia
10 (1,206%): Netherlands Antilles
16 (1,117%): Belgium
8 (1,080%): Lithuania
15 (1,047%): Morocco
6 (0,876%): Nigeria
6 (0,810%): Slovakia
6 (0,810%): Yugoslavia
10 (0,698%): France
5 (0,603%): Jamaica
5 (0,603%): Cuba
4 (0,540%): Romania
4 (0,482%): Ecuador
3 (0,405%): Albania
3 (0,362%): Puerto Rico
3 (0,362%): Mexico
3 (0,362%): Costa Rica
3 (0,362%): Argentina
5 (0,349%): Turkey
4 (0,325%): Philippines
3 (0,303%): Portugal
2 (0,292%): South Africa
2 (0,270%): Latvia
2 (0,270%): Estonia
3 (0,209%): Tunesia
3 (0,209%): Austria
2 (0,162%): China
1 (0,146%): Gambia
1 (0,146%): Cameroon
1 (0,146%): Sierra Leone
1 (0,146%): Mauretania
2 (0,140%): Denmark
2 (0,140%): England
1 (0,135%): Chechnya
1 (0,135%): Armenia
1 (0,121%): Peru
1 (0,121%): Panama
1 (0,070%): Egypt
1 (0,070%): Algeria
1 (0,070%): Finland
1 (0,070%): Sweden
1 (0,070%): Scotland
1 (0,070%): Ireland
1 (0,070%): Iceland
1 (0,070%): Switzerland
1 (0,070%): Iraq
1 (0,070%): Palestine

Unfortunately I didn't count ethnicities among Dutch prostitutes, so, Dutch Moroccan prostitutes were simply "Moroccan". And I didn't record the fact that prostitutes often mention different nationalities to different clients, I often assumed the last mentioned was the right one (I simply thought the clients were mistaken). It took many months for me to realize that prostitutes could actually lie; that Italian and Greece prostitutes are not probably not Italian or Greece but probably Bulgarian or Albanian.

Unfortunately I also didn't look at the sexual activities done by prostitutes and clients.

Or the money paid to the prostitutes, or times spent with them.

But I did record ages, unfortunately, not differentiating between estimates by clients and ages mentioned by prostitutes. But I will make a "flashback" to 2008 and include the estimates of that year too, which will make the data comparable (but I don't use the estimates in the review forms).

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 309 prostitutes:
average: 27,286 (SD=6,833)
18-23: 34,951%
24-29: 36,570%
30-39: 21,036%
40 years or older: 7,443%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 75 Eastern European prostitutes:
average: 25,600 (SD=4,471)
18-23: 32,000%
24-29: 48,000%
30-39: 20,000%
40 years or older: 0%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 62 Latin American prostitutes:
average: 30,169 (SD=7,697)
18-23: 22,581%
24-29: 30,645%
30-39: 30,645%
40 years or older: 16,129%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 78 Dutch prostitutes:
average: 26,532 (SD=7,655)
18-23: 47,436%
24-29: 30,769%
30-39: 14,103%
40 years or older:7,692%

Back to 2008:
ages mentioned and guessed ages of 840 prostitutes (in 2008):
average: 27,215 (SD=6,987)
18-23: 40,833%
24-29: 32,262%
30-39: 19,762%
40 years or older:7,143%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 446 Eastern European prostitutes (in 2008):
average: 24,866 (SD=5,049)
18-23: 53,363%
24-29: 32,063%
30-39: 13,004%
40 years or older:1,570%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 138 Latin American prostitutes (in 2008):
average: 33,578 (SD=7,709)
18-23: 5,072%
24-29: 34,058%
30-39: 38,406%
40 years or older: 22,464%

ages mentioned and guessed ages of 141 Dutch prostitutes (in 2008):
average: 26,349 (SD=7,002)
18-23: 53,191%
24-29: 24,113%
30-39: 16,312%
40 years or older: 6,383%

Saturday, December 20, 2008

Club prostitutes 2008

I finally finished my hookers.nl club count.

I counted 1109 prostitutes in clubs and privéhuizen, far less than described in window prostitution. I want to keep the data comparable to window prostitution so I left out prostitutes which were observed outside the period between November the 14th 2007 and November the 14th 2008. This way I'm left with 891 prostitutes.

In this count it was clear that the prostitutes reviewed in Limburg and Noord Brabant were far overrepresented compared to other areas. Especially the saunaclubs in Limburg are well described. The charactaristics of the prostitutes in the rest of the Netherlands are very consistent, but in Limburg there are many "German" and Eastern European prostitutes. In Noord Brabant on the other hand the Dutch women dominate. So you must take that into account. It is also true that in sauna clubs the women far more often give blowjobs without a condom.

Hookers.nl divides the prostitutes in groups. The prostitutes are grouped as follows. I also give the percentage of the prostitutes in that group of whom a country of origin was named.

20,539% Eastern Europe (of 80,874% women a country of origin was named)
3,255% No Group (37,931%)
2,806% Africa (72,000%)
36,700% The Netherlands (100%)
7,071% Germany (100%)
2,132% Belgium (100%)
2,918% Southern Europe (84,615%)
4,938% Thailand (100%)
0,337% China (100%)
9,203% Latin America (64,634%)
3,479% Surinam (100%)
3,367% different (73,333%)
3,255% other Asian (79.310%)

The following countries of origin are named (of 784 prostitutes). I also mention a percentage in which I assume that all the other prostitutes in a certain group of whom NO country of origin is named have the same characteristics as the group who do have a country of origin named.

341 (39,190%): The Netherlands
51 (7,278%): Poland
62 (7,012%): Germany
44 (4,938%): Thailand
31 (4,345%): Hungary
24 (4,024%): Brazil
21 (2,418%): Surinam
19 (2,153%): Belgium
15 (2,075%): Romania
11 (1,875%): Colombia
13 (1,872%): Indonesia
11 (1,841%): Bulgaria
11 (1,828%): Dominican Republic
12 (1,680%): Slovakia
12 (1,639%): Russia
8 (1,335%): Morocco
9 (1,249%): Czech Republic
8 (1,050%): Italy
6 (0,833%): Latvia
7 (0,815%): "Hindustani"
5 (0,707%): Netherlands Antilles
4 (0,624%): Ghana
4 (0,539%): Spain
4 (0,539%): Turkey
3 (0,521%): Venezuela
2 (0,470%): Cuba
3 (0,442%): Tunesia
3 (0,425%): Philippines
3 (0,416%): Lithuania
3 (0,398%): Portugal
2 (0,347%): Jamaica
2 (0,312%): Sierra Leone
1 (0,296%): Belarus
1 (0,296%): "Africa"
1 (0,296%): "other Asian"
2 (0,283%): Japan
2 (0,278%): Ukraine
2 (0,265%): Greece
2 (0,224%): China
1 (0,174%): Liberia
1 (0,174%): Mexico
1 (0,174%): Haiti
1 (0,174%): Bolivia
1 (0,156%): Nigeria
1 (0,156%): Ivory Coast
1 (0,156%): Somalia
1 (0,156%): Kenia
1 (0,156%): Madagascar
1 (0,156%): Uganda
1 (0,153%): United States of America
1 (0,142%): Vietnam
1 (0,142%): India
1 (0,142%): Pakistan
1 (0,139%): Yugoslavia
1 (0,139%): Sweden
1 (0,139%): Kazachstan
1 (0,139%): Israel
1 (0,112%): Austria

This time the prostitutes were far more consistent when they mentioned nationalities, in only 12 cases there were discrepencies. The nationalities I mention on the left are what I found most obvious and which I chose in the list above.
(2x) Eastern Europe = Italy
Slovakia = Czech Republic
Latvia = Estionia, Russia
Hungary = Czech Republic
Netherlands = China
Italy = Netherlands
Indonesia = "Hindustani"
Turkey = (Tunesia/Germany)
Colombia = Brazil
Colombia = Venezuela
Netherlands Antilles = Surinam

Of 30 Dutch prostitutes (of a total of 341) a different ethnic background was mentioned:
5 Morocco
4 Indonesia
3 Netherlands Antilles
3 "foreign"
1 Poland
1 Russia
1 Yugoslavia
1 Gambia
1 Tunesia
1 Egypt
1 Italy
1 Spain
1 "Asia"
1 South Korea
1 Turkey
1 "Latin America"
1 Surinam
1 "Hindustani"
1 "black"

The situation in window prostitution changed dramatically since 3 years ago, but in the clubs the situation seems to be very similar, just like a time freeze, the Dutch prostitutes still dominate, and many Eastern European prostitutes in clubs are Polish. I realize that I didn't mention detailed information per type of prostitution for the situation 3 years ago, so the reader cannot compare for themselves. I will do it in the future.

It is striking that in clubs (and privéhuizen) the prostitutes far more often engage into unsafe sex, but this time the differences between subgroups are not as large as compared to window prostitution.

I counted the types of unsafe sex the prostitutes (and clients) went into:
of 891 prostitutes:
39,843% blowjob without a condom
67,677% kissing
68,575% cunnilingus
9,203% anal with condom
1,122% anal without condom
13,244% rimming (buttlicking)
6,734% facial
3,030% coitus without condom

Now I will differentiate between subgroups.

of 189 Eastern European prostitutes
40,741% blowjob without a condom
57,672% kissing
61,376% cunnilingus
4,233% anal with condom
0,529% anal without condom
7,937% rimming (buttlicking)
2,646% facial
0,529% coitus without condom

of 111 Latin American prostitutes
27,928% blowjob without a condom
67,568% kissing
70,270% cunnilingus
6,306% anal with condom
0,000% anal without condom
5,405% rimming (buttlicking)
3,604% facial
2,703% coitus without condom

of 341 Dutch prostitutes
35,777% blowjob without a condom
75,660% kissing
75,073% cunnilingus
11,730% anal with condom
1,173% anal without condom
15,294% rimming (buttlicking)
8,504% facial
2,346% coitus without condom

of 44 Thai prostitutes
38,636% blowjob without a condom
61,364% kissing
61,364% cunnilingus
2,273% anal with condom
2,273% anal without condom
9,091% rimming (buttlicking)
4,545% facial
13,636% coitus without condom

of 62 German prostitutes
77,419% blowjob without a condom
64,516% kissing
70,968% cunnilingus
16,129% anal with condom
1,613% anal without condom
20,968% rimming (buttlicking)
11,290% facial
3,226% coitus without condom

of 524 prostitutes younger than 30 (I also use age estimates derived from review forms)
40,267% blowjob without a condom
66,794% kissing
67,366% cunnilingus
8,015% anal with condom
0,382% anal without condom
10,687% rimming (buttlicking)
5,153% facial
0,954% coitus without condom

of 319 prostitutes 30 years or older (I also use age estimates derived from review forms)
42,006% blowjob without a condom
72,100% kissing
73,668% cunnilingus
12,226% anal with condom
2,508% anal without condom
17,868% rimming (buttlicking)
10,031% facial
6,897% coitus without condom

Ages mentioned by 222 prostitutes
Average 28,280 (SD=7,455)
18-23: 32,432%
24-29: 33,784%
30-39: 24,324%
40 years or older: 9,459%

Ages mentioned by 55 Eastern European prostitutes
Average 25,341 (SD=5,510)
18-23: 41,818%
24-29: 41,818%
30-39: 12,727%
40 years or older: 3,636%

Ages mentioned by 30 Latin American prostitutes
Average: 28,648 (SD=6,521)
18-23: 23,333%
24-29: 36,667%
30-39: 33,333%
40 years or older: 6,667%

Ages mentioned by 80 Dutch prostitutes
Average: 28,406 (SD=7,416)
18-23: 36,250%
24-29: 26,250%
30-39: 30,000%
40 years or older: 7,500%

Clients typically pay 105 euros for 55 minutes of sex. The differences between different groups of prostitutes are not big, only the Latin American prostitutes are slightly cheaper; 1,7 euros per minute compared to 2 euros per minute for the others.

Tuesday, December 09, 2008

Window prostitutes 2008

Finally my window prostitute hookers.nl count is done.

I counted 2289 prostitutes but I had to leave some off because the reviews were too old. I started counting on November the 14th, so I decided to only analyze the prostitutes between November 14th 2007 and November 14th 2008.

The clients can fill in review forms where they can group the prostitutes into the following subgroups. I added some numbers and percentages. This time around of many prostitutes also a nationality is mentioned in the reviews, so that is interesting (these percentages were much less 3 years ago).

827 (45,044%): Eastern European (for 87,908% a nationality is named)
376 (20,479%): Latina (79,521%)
283 (15,414%): Dutch (obviously 100%)
114 (6,209%): Southern Europe (90,351%)
49 (2,669%): other (83,673%)
44 (2,397%): German (97,727%)
39 (2,124%): African (69,231%)
33 (1,797%): Thai (100%)
23 (1,253%): no group (86,957%)
22 (1,198%): "other Asians"
13 (0,708%): Surinamese (92,308%)
10 (0,545%): Belgian (100%)
3 (0,163%): Chinese (100%)

The nationalities mentioned are the following. Many prostitutes mentioned different nationalities to different clients, so I had to make a choice which one I found the most logical. The percentages mentioned are adjusted in such a way that for instance; prostitutes who are thought by the clients to be "Eastern European" are assumed to have the same distribution of nationalities as the other Eastern European women.

Total number of prostitutes:1836
Total number of prostitutes who named a nationality:1622
304 (16,689%): The Netherlands
226 (14,002%): Bulgaria
186 (11,522%): Hungary
123 (8,367%): Dominican Republic
93 (5,758%): Romania
79 (4,873%): Poland
63 (4,292%): Colombia
59 (3,650%): Czech Republic
46 (3,134%): Brazil
42 (2,851%): Venezuela
35 (2,156%): Spain
36 (2,006%): Germany
36 (1,974%): Thailand
30 (1,809%): Italy
15 (0,929%): Lithuania
12 (0,810%): Cuba
13 (0,805%): Ukraine
13 (0,799%): Greece
11 (0,682%): Latvia
11 (0,649%): Surinam
7 (0,551%): Ghana
8 (0,547%): Morocco
7 (0,524%): Jamaica
8 (0,491%): Albania
9 (0,490%): Belgium
6 (0,462%): Nigeria
7 (0,450%): France
7 (0,445%): Austria
7 (0,434%): Slovakia
6 (0,370%): Croatia
6 (0,362%): Kosovo
5 (0,342%): Puerto Rico
5 (0,342%): Panama
4 (0,274%): Chile
3 (0,205%): Ecuador
3 (0,205%): Costa Rica
3 (0,195%): England
3 (0,186%): Slovenia
3 (0,181%): Portugal
3 (0,171%): Philippines
3 (0,169%): Indonesia
2 (0,144%): Tunesia
2 (0,137%): Mexico
2 (0,134%): Netherlands Antilles
2 (0,134%): Argentina
2 (0,127%): Turkey
2 (0,124%): Serbia
2 (0,124%): Belarus
2 (0,124%): Moldova
2 (0,116%): Macedonia
1 (0,079%): Liberia
1 (0,079%): Sierra Leone
1 (0,079%): Mauretania
1 (0,079%): Guinea
1 (0,068%): Peru
1 (0,068%): Martinique
1 (0,068%): Guyana
1 (0,068%): Trinidad and Tobago
1 (0,065%): Scotland
1 (0,065%): Switzerland
1 (0,065%): Australia
1 (0,065%): United States of America
1 (0,065%): "Arab"
1 (0,065%): Iran
1 (0,063%): "middle east"
1 (0,062%): Estonia
1 (0,062%): Armenia
1 (0,060%): Egypt
1 (0,057%): Malaysia
1 (0,057%): "Hindustani"
1 (0,054%): China
1 (0,054%): Laos

I will also mention the cases where prostitutes mentioned different nationalities. The ones on the left are the ones I found the most plausible. Prostitutes will also often say they are halfbloods, so when she says she has a Italian and Bulgarian parents I write (Italy/Bulgaria).

104 cases
Albania = Italy
Albania = Czech Republic, Serbia
Albania = Serbia
Armenia = Germany
Brazil = Cuba
Brazil = Jamaica
Bulgaria = Croatia
(3x) Bulgaria = Czech Republic
Bulgaria = (Czech Republic/Hungary), Yugoslavia, Hungary
(2x) Bulgaria = Greece
Bulgaria = (Greece/Bulgaria)
(9x) Bulgaria = Hungary
Bulgaria = Hungary, Finland
Bulgaria = Italy, Romania
Bulgaria = Italy, Hungary
Bulgaria = Lebanon, Tunesia, Turkey
Bulgaria = Poland
Bulgaria = (Poland/Germany), (Bulgaria/Germany)
Bulgaria = Romania
(2x) Bulgaria = Russia
Bulgaria = Spain, (Spain/Bulgaria)
Bulgaria = South Africa
Colombia = Argentina
(2x) Colombia = Brazil
Colombia = Dominican Republic
Colombia = Portugal, Spain
Colombia = Spain
Colombia = Venezuela
Croatia = Yugoslavia
Cuba = (Italy/Latin America)
Czech Republic = (Portugal)
Czech Republic = (Slovakia/Greece)
Dominican Republic = Brazil
Dominican Republic = Colombia
Dominican Republic = (Cuba/Brazil)
Dominican Republic = (Jamaica/Latin America)
Dominican Republic = Netherlands Antilles
Dominican Republic = (Netherlands Antilles/Indonesia)
Dominican Republic = Portugal, Colombia
Dominican Republic = Spain
Dominican Republic = Venezuela
Ghana = Jamaica
Hungary = Austria
Hungary = Italy
Hungary = Poland
Indonesia = Thailand
Italy = Greece
Latin America = Spain
Lithuania = Slovenia
Macedonia = Belgium
Martinique = France
Mauretania = France
Moldova = Russia
Morocco = Palestine
(2x) Netherlands = Greece
Nigeria = Burundi
Nigeria = Ghana, Cameroon
Philippines = Thailand, Malaysia
Poland = Austria
(2x) Poland = Italy
Poland = Russia
Romania = Bulgaria
(2x) Romania = Czech Republic
Romania = Greece, Spain
(5x) Romania = Hungary
(2x) Romania = Hungary, Bulgaria
(4x) Romania = Italy
Romania = Spain
Romania = Yugoslavia, Croatia
Russia = Germany
(2x) Russia = Poland
Slovakia = Croatia, Czech Republic
Spain = Romania
Ukraine = Czech Republic
(2x) Ukraine = Russia
Venezuela = Brazil
Venezuela = Uzbekistan

I conclude that the nationalities mentioned cannot be very reliable. But it is stunning to see how many "Bulgarian" "Romanian" and "Hungarian" prostitutes have entered Dutch window prostitution.

Many Dutch prostitutes have a foreign background. Clients also mention these backgrounds of some Dutch prostitutes.

Of the 304 Dutch prostitutes 49 were mentioned to have a non Dutch ethnicity:
8 Morocco
6 Indonesia
5 Surinam
4 China
4 Hindustani
3 Turkey
2 "Africa"
2 Italy
1 Poland
1 Russia
1 Armenia
1 Macedonia
1 Tunesia
1 Egypt
1 Sweden
1 Philippines
1 India
1 Maluku Islands
1 Syria
1 Kurdish
1 Netherlands Antilles
1 Dominican Republic
1 Brazil

Clients can also give marks on the review form for different kinds of (unsafe) sex, such as coitus without condom or kissing. Of the 1836 prostitutes mentioned, I noted what kinds of (unsafe) sex they performed with the clients. I have to add though that there are very different opinions about the level of unsafety of these kinds of sexual activity.
14,216%: blowjob without condom
28,922%: kissing
38,508%: Cunnilingus
7,843%: anal with condom
0,926%: anal without condom
10,512%: rimming (buttlicking)
4,303%: facial
3,322%: coitus without condom

Now, a closer look for different groups of prostitutes.

For 858 Eastern European prostitutes:
13,054%: blowjob without condom
23,427%: kissing
36,131%: cunnilingus
5,245%: anal with condom
0,816%: anal without condom
7,226%: rimming (buttlicking)
3,147%: facial
3,030%: coitus without condom

For 413 Latin American prostitutes
23,002%: blowjob without condom
42,615%: kissing
48,668%: cunnilingus
9,201%: anal with condom
1,695%: anal without condom
15,496%: rimming (buttlicking)
6,295%: facial
5,811%: coitus without condom

For 304 Dutch prostitutes:
6,908%: blowjob without condom
28,289%: kissing
32,895%: cunnilingus
10,526%: anal with condom
0,658%: anal without condom
11,513%: rimming (buttlicking)
4,934%: facial
2,303%: coitus without condom

For 1235 prostitutes younger than 30 (I also use age estimates derived from review forms)
10,040%: blowjob without condom
20,486%: kissing
33,279%: cunnilingus
5,911%: anal with condom
0,486%: anal without condom
7,287%: rimming (buttlicking)
2,996%: facial
2,024%: coitus without condom

For 555 prostitutes 30 years or older (I also use age estimates derived from review forms)
23,964%: blowjob without condom
48,829%: kissing
51,892%: cunnilingus
12,252%: anal with condom
1,982: anal without condom
18,378%: rimming (buttlicking)
7,387%: facial
6,306%: coitus without condom

Notice that Latin American and older prostitutes have unsafe sex far more often. The last is also true within the seperate subgroups. So older Dutch prostitutes far more often have unsafe sex than the younger, same goes for the Eastern European women.

I also analyzed the ages mentioned. Prostitutes often mention different ages to different clients. In these cases I picked the oldest possible age. I also adjusted the ages to the last observation made (so if a prostitutes on June 2006 says she was 30 and the last observation made of her was on June 2008, I will add two years). I don't think the ages mentioned are too reliable. Many prostitutes have not mentioned their ages, and there are good reasons that many lie about their ages. Also older prostitutes are less eager to mention their age. And what could also be true is that older prostitutes are less popular than the younger (what could explain why older prostitutes far more often engage in unsafe sex). I also believe Latin American prostitutes are less popular.

ages mentioned of 717 prostitutes:
average: 26,583 (SD=6,745)
18-23: 44,212%
24-29: 32,775%
30-39: 16,876%
40 or older: 6,137%

ages mentioned of 402 Eastern European prostitutes:
average: 24,632 (SD=5,041)
18-23: 55,473%
24-29: 30,846%
30-39: 12,189%
40 or older: 1,493%

ages mentioned of 101 Latin American prostitutes
average: 32,836 (SD=7,929)
18-23: 5,941%
24-29: 39,604%
30-39: 32,673%
40 or older: 21,782%

ages mentioned of 119 Dutch prostitutes
average: 25,689 (SD 6,711)
18-23: 57,983%
24-29: 23,529%
30-39: 12,605%
40 or older: 5,882%

The clients typically pay 50 euros for 25 minutes of sex. The differences between groups are not very big. Only the Latin American women are paid slightly less per minute (app 1,6 euro) compared to the rest (app 2 euro). Also prostitutes 30 years or older are paid slightly less per minute (app 1,7 euro) compared to the rest (app 2 euro).

Perhaps I will do some extra analyses in the future. Now, it's time to move on the the club and privéhuis prostitutes.

Thursday, December 04, 2008

Weak!

http://www.metronieuws.nl/index.php?actie=nieuws&c=2&id=142152

From the Dutch newspaper Metro ('Ik deed het alleen voor ons...' [I only did it for us...'], by Milou van der Will, December 3th 2008):

Mo took Melissa and within a day they rented a window on De Wallen. She got a pile of condoms, no lubricants and was put behind the window. When the first client knocked on the door Mo was on the opposite side [of the street] with a knife. If it would only enter her mind... "That first time I only cried, the bizarre thing is that many clients seem to get a kick out of that. Mo was very happy afterwards, he was proud of me and cuddled me. After every customer he collected the money."

By the way, I am busy with another count among prostitutes using a client review website. It seems that actually the number of (window) prostitutes from the Balkans has spectacularly increased during the last three years! (or maybe during the last 2 since the borders have been opened for Bulgaria and Romania) My guess is that most window prostitutes nowadays are Eastern European compared to some 20% three years ago. I think more than a quarter are from the Balkans. The number of Dutch window prostitutes has decreased.

Wednesday, November 19, 2008

Another Turkish gang

Another large Turkish gang is active in the red light districts of the Netherlands. Two Turkish brothers (Murat and Mehmet O) and another person have been arrested on the 11th of November. They sought contact with hundreds of women on websites like chatnu.nl, netlog.com, hyves.net and partypeepers.nl . Murat was known as misterr_diamond on netlog. They brought dozens of women into prostitution. They have been operating for a number of years. They had women behind the windows of Amsterdam, Alkmaar and Utrecht. According to Harold van Gelder (the coordinator on human trafficking in Amsterdam) the pimps didn't use violence, but that's not true according to a certain Mohammed, an ex-pimp who was friends the brothers. According to Harold van Gelder these brothers moved into the vacuum left behind by the other gang after they were rounded up, but that seems unlikely to me because the bodyguards of the other gang walk around freely.

Sources:
http://www.ad.nl/denhaag/stad/2778122/Haagse_pooiers_ronselen_via_websites.html
http://www.ad.nl/denhaag/2778125/Websites_jachtterrein_Haagse_pooiers.html
http://www.hartvannederland.nl/localitem/15688/Oude_vriend_loverboys_in_exclusief_interview

Sunday, November 09, 2008

Highly educated Bulgarian sex workers

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Okay, I think it will be better if this will involve into a newssite.......

The following is a Dutch article from the free newspaper "De Pers" (neatly translated into English)


http://www.depers.nl/binnenland/258893/Film-licht-Bulgaarse-prostituees-voor.html

Pilot Abuses among highly educated women
Film informs Bulgarian prostitutes
Maaike Boersma
5 November 2008

Highly educated Bulgarian women without perspective work in our country as prostitutes. A pilot project in Groningen and Friesland attacks abuses.
The northern provinces are going to deal with Bulgarian human traffickers much harder. Groningen and Friesland were given two tons [of euros] from the national government to start a two year pilot. ‘Since the entry of Bulgaria into the EU many Bulgarian women have come to the Netherlands to work here as prostitutes’, says the public prosecutor Oebele Brouwer.

Since two years at least 150 Bulgarian women are active in the northern provinces. According to Brouwer they mainly are highly educated women. According to him they don’t come here under false pretences. ‘But still there is a very negative choice behind this. Despite having a diploma, they can’t find work in Bulgaria. To maintain their family nevertheless, they finally decide to work as a prostitute in the Netherlands, because large sums of money are held out for them’. This is especially deceptive because once the women are working, they have to hand over nearly all their money to the traffickers. ‘They then say: “we took you here, you must pay off the debt to us.” ’

With the pilot the provinces want to be one step ahead of these abuses. One of the aspects is training Bulgarian policemen. ‘They come to here for a month of three, four and learn to work with our system’, says Brouwer. The intention is that the policemen can already do preventive work in their own country. ‘Above all we then have a better insight into what happens with the women after they have been interviewed here. Now they go back to Eastern Bulgaria and we lose them. If the intimidation continues in their home country, we have no insight into this anymore’, says Brouwer.

Another idea is to make a documentary about Bulgarian prostitutes in the Netherlands as a way to give the Bulgarian women a better picture about how things go in the Dutch prostitution branch.

Most abuses come to light through inspections, says Brouwer. ‘So, lately there was a 16 year old girl behind the window. She had a false passport which said she was eighteen. She worked in prostitution since she was fourteen.’

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Friday, November 07, 2008

Joran

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Talking about Thai prostitutes, it seems that we have to welcome Joran as a new special guest.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/11/holloway_suspect_trafficks_in.php

Holloway suspect 'trafficks in women'

Friday 07 November 2008

Joran van der Sloot, the young man believed to be involved the disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway on Aruba, is now involved in selling Thai women into prostitution, claims tv crime reporter Peter R de Vries.

(...)

According to this latest exposé, Van der Sloot makes €10,000 for every girl he delivers to the Dutch prostitution market. The girls will work for ‘just 300 dollars a month’ he is reported as saying on camera.

During conversations taped in a hotel in Bangkok, Van der Sloot tells a man posing as a Dutch sex industry boss that he can organise visas and passports for the girls, who think they are going to the Netherlands to work as dancers.

(...)

© DutchNews.nl

..... and that makes me wonder; lately I ignored lots of news related to prostitution here. Lots of windows in Alkmaar are closed, it is suspected that most prostitutes in the window-boat-brothels in Utrecht are forced, Jos van der Meer closed his ~40 clubs. Lots of things going on. Those brothel closures are not interesting, many brothels are under-occupied anyway, they are not missed by the prostitutes (and sex traffickers).

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Monday, November 03, 2008

Burnout

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Lately I mentioned the report by Ine Vanwesenbeeck called:
Burnout among female indoor sex workers [Archives of Sexual Behavior Dec , 2005, Ine Vanwesenbeeck]
The website prostitution procon mentions some quotes of her report:

This study provided evidence that female indoor sex workers in the Netherlands do not exhibit a higher level of work-related emotional exhaustion or a lower level of work-related personal competence than a comparison group of female health care workers (mostly nurses)....

The fact that findings were partly contrary to expectations and contrary to suggestions from others that sex work is intrinsically traumatizing may be explained by sample differences. Here, indoor sex workers were studied, whereas many other studies focus almost exclusively on street workers..."


I took the time to actually read the report (you can download a cheap version here)

I found out that the group of prostitutes Ine Vanwesenbeeck studied in this report is the same as in another report she (co-)wrote with Liesbeth Venicz in 2000: “Er gaat iets veranderen in de prostitutie... - De sociale positie en het psychosociaal welzijn van prostituees in prostitutiebedrijven voorafgaand aan de opheffing van het bordeelverbod” [Something’s going to change in prostitution… - The social position and psychosocial wellbeing of prostitutes the prostitution businesses prior to the lifting of the ban on brothels]. (you can download it here)

In her burnout study she mentions:
Recruitment of sex workers took place by means of fieldwork. Five fieldworkers, who were either prostitution social workers or ex-prostitutes, were trained specifically for this project. Together, they visited a total of 138 sex work sites, selected on the basis of the fieldworkers' network and according to considerations of geographical dispersion. Some of the interviewers were fluent in languages that are spoken by relatively high numbers of sex workers in the Netherlands (e.g., English, Spanish, and Czech) and were provided with translated questionnaires in those languages. In 67 sites (49%), at least one worker agreed to participate in the study. Because the number of sex workers addressed varied per site, it is uncertain what the response rate on the level of individuals was. A total of 105 sex workers were interviewed. Five of these were males and four were male-to-female transsexuals. They were excluded from the analyses here. The remaining 96 female sex workers were, on average, 30.6 years of age (SD = 8.4) and had, on average, worked as a sex worker for 7.3 years (SD = 6.0). Other demographic characteristics are presented in Table I.

Burnout scores of two comparison groups were taken from Schaufeli and van Dierendonck (2000) [she means: Schaufeli, W. B., & van Dierendonck, D. (1995). A cautionary note about the cross-national and clinical validity of cut-off points for the Maslach Burnout Inventory. Psychological Reports, 76, 1083-1090.]. The first comparison group (N = 2,043) consisted of female health care workers, mostly nurses, with an average age of 36 years (SD = 10.1). The second comparison group consisted of people in treatment for work-related psychological problems (N = 142), with an average age of 41.9 years (SD = 8.9). The group was 40% female and 60% male, but no sex differences related to burnout were found. These people were from a variety of professional backgrounds, with half of them having a higher educational level. They were patients for, on average, 4.8 months (SD = 8.3).

(…)

Burnout was measured using a validated Dutch version of the Maslach Burnout Inventory, the Utrecht Burnout Scale for the Contactual professions (UBOS-C; Schaufeli & van Dierendonck, 2000). The UBOS-C consists of 20 items and 3 factors: emotional exhaustion, depersonalization, and personal competence. Participants were asked to rate the frequency with which they experienced various feelings on a 7-point scale, ranging from 0 (never) to 6 (always/daily).
Some numbers from table III (Mean Scores on Burnout Factors for Female Sex Workers, Female Health Care Workers, and People in Treatment for Work-Related Psychological Complaints):

Sex workers (N=96):
Emotional Exhaustion: M=14,9 (SD=11,7)
Depersonalization: M=8,9 (SD=6,1)
Personal competence: M=27,5 (SD=7,9)

Health care workers (N=2043):
Emotional Exhaustion: M=15,3 (SD=8,1)
Depersonalization: M=6,8 (SD=4,2)
Personal competence: M=27,4 (SD=5,6)

Patients (N=142):
Emotional Exhaustion: M=26,0 (SD=9,5)
Depersonalization: M=9,3 (SD=4,9)
Personal competence: M=24,5 (SD=5,1)

She did more or less the same in her Er gaat iets veranderen study, using the same validated Dutch version of the Maslach Burnout Inventory. You might guess that (even if you take into account that the males and transsexuals are not included in the Burnout version of her study) that the numbers should be more or less the same. But they turn out to be COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!!!! In her Er gaat iets veranderen study (see pages 76-77) the number for Emotional exhaustion for the prostitutes is 23,7. The number for Depersonalization was 14,2. The number for Personal Competence is 34,1. The fact that the males and transsexuals were included doesn’t explain this (except when you assume that their average number for Emotional Exhaustion exceeds 117, for Depersonalization it exceeds 70 and for Personal Competence it exceeds 104, which seems all very unlikely to me). She even calls the high score on Emotional Exhaustion worrying. It could be that Ine Vanwesenbeeck has made an error. It must be. But which are the right numbers?

And if the earlier numbers are true, the numbers of the prostitutes are in my opinion more or less comparable to those of the people (Patients) in treatment for work-related psychological problems. And if you take into account (see page 21 in the Er gaat iets veranderen study) that the researchers had the impression that during fieldwork of the research forced prostitutes didn’t want to cooperate (in addition to the quarter of the women who admitted that they have initially been forced into prostitution), you can assume that their situation is even worse.

Anyway, Vanwesenbeeck also made Correlations of Person- and Work-Related Variables with Burnout Factors in her Burnout report and these numbers correspond reasonably with those of the ones mentioned in her Er gaat iets veranderen report. These numbers show that there’s not such much a relationship between prostitution and distress per se, but in combination with having little control over interaction with clients or being forced in prostitution it could have a negative influence. Also having negative feelings about working in prostitution could cause distress. But that seems logical. Having sex per se doesn’t cause distress. Being forced to have sex or doing sexual things you don’t like could cause distress.

However, the newer Dutch reports about the social position of prostitutes in 2001 and 2006 didn’t reveal much difference between prostitutes and the general population. That’s the more surprising when you assume many prostitutes come from poor countries. In the latter report the prostitutes even had lower distress levels on average than the general population. Perhaps the situation in the brothels in the Netherlands actually did improve. This is still difficult, how much of this is related to sample biases?

The solutions to the problems prostitutes face are very simple if you would believe Ine in her burnout report:
Personnel policies, work relations, support structures, the organizational culture, and protection of personnel from violence on the work site have come forward here as relevant criteria by which "good" businesses can be distinguished from "bad" ones. Under a regulatory system, norms in relation to these aspects can be set. These would have to come about in collaboration between authorities and the parties involved so that they are broadly accepted. Departure from these norms could be met with sanctions. To promote broad application as well as other positive developments in relation to work relations, support structures and organizational cultures, both managers and sex workers may be provided with education and training. The sex business has no tradition of formal negotiation of work relations and sex workers are not used to claiming their rights as workers. A process toward better work relations, worker protection, and an improved status of sex workers, once facilitated by a legislative system as now available in the Netherlands, certainly needs further government support.

Finally, clearly it is not only their experience at work that threatens sex workers' health. Acceptance of their professional choice in their private lives appears vitally important as well. Legal rights for sex workers as a professional group are a precondition for adequate government intervention, but does not yet guarantee societal acceptance of sex workers. The struggle against social stigma of sex workers and the reduction or prevention of negative social reactions toward them should be an additional aim of any policy working toward improvement of sex workers' social status and well-being.
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Monday, October 20, 2008

Thai women in parlours

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The Red Thread published a new report:

Een vergeten groep of Thaise vrouwen in (erotische) salons in Nederland (De Rode Draad, October 2008) [a forgotten group of Thai women in (erotic) parlours in the Netherlands]

http://www.rodedraad.nl/fileadmin/user_upload/internet.pdf

The report doesn’t really contain much new information compared to earlier Red Thread reports (read for instance my earlier post about Thai prostitutes).

According to the Red Thread there are some 400 Thai prostitutes in the Netherlands working in Thai massage parlours. Often they are older women who reside legally in the Netherlands. Often they seem to be the remnants of an earlier wave of human trafficking from Thailand during the seventies and eighties, at which time the victims were much younger. They hardly speak Dutch.
The Red Thread has a list of some 150 businesses of which they visited 63. There’s a very big turnover of massage parlours. Many businesses stop operating very quickly while at the same time new businesses are opened.
There are some good Thai massage parlours where the women are treated well but many others are not so good. The women work long days (like 78 hours a week) and seem to have a limited freedom of movement. They often sleep in the brothels and often spend time with girlfriends and colleagues in other massage parlours. Not many clients visit these brothels, often some two or three clients a day. The women don’t make a lot of money, often some three to five euros per hour.
Much to the surprise of the Red Thread it turned out there was a drugs problem among the Thai prostitutes. One type of drugs used was ‘ya ba’, or methylamphetamine, also known as crystal meth. It is 9 times stronger than speed.
There’s also a gambling problem among the prostitutes.
The labour relations are often not good. Often the women are supposed to be working in wage labour, but the full rights associated with this type of labour are not granted. Others are supposed to be working under the ‘opting in’-system where the woman works more or less as an independent contractor, but in this system the taxes are dealt with by the boss. Also here the rights of the women are violated.
There are also traditional Thai massage parlours which only seem to do massage. Also women visit these massage parlours. But some workers secretly also offer sex (often hand jobs). In one parlour the workers prefer men over women because the traditional massages are very intensive, and it’s a lot less hard work to erotically massage a man than to traditionally massage a woman. The extra money is for the worker.

The last thing about the prostitutes preferring sex work over ‘normal’ work really surprises me! This is another indication that working in prostitution is not so emotionally troubling at all! Perhaps Ine Vanwesenbeeck is right after all. (or maybe it is that just all wage labour is like prostitution, and that means that Marx is right after all......)

For Ine Vanwesenbeeck look on the website of prostitution.procon.org:
Is prostitution psychologically harmful to prostitutes?

For Karl Marx look on the website of marxists.org :
Private Property and Communism

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Wednesday, September 10, 2008

Shared Hope

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I read through that Shared Hope report.

There's interesting information on
http://www.sharedhope.org/Resources/DEMAND.aspx
and there's even a 45 minute documentary featuring Toos Heemskerk-Schep and her husband Willem Heemskerk (both from the Christian organization Het Scharlaken Koord [Scarlet Cord]). This page also mentions the full report:
DEMAND. A Comparative Examination of Sex Tourism and Trafficking in Jamaica, Japan, the Netherlands, and the United States

The full copy can be downloaded here:
http://www.sharedhope.org/Portals/0/Documents/DEMAND.pdf

A section is about Dutch prostitution and can be separately downloaded here:
http://www.sharedhope.org/Portals/0/Documents/demand_netherlands.pdf
It contains information from Het Scharlaken Koord (Scarlet Cord) about the women who work in the RLD of Amsterdam (Wallen). See pages 52-53 (Survey report written and translated by Scarlet Cord, edited by Shared Hope International, August 2005). And some detailed information about their nationalities! What surprises me is the large number of Latin Americans mentioned. 42% of the women come from that part of the world (99 out of 237). I did a count on hookers.nl (a review site for prostitution clients) during that period, but the Latin American women weren't that prominent. Perhaps they are not so popular among the clients. Also funny is that the Scarlet Cord also encounters the usual girls from "Italy" and "Greece" (probably Eastern European women from Bulgaria, Romania and Albania).

The Scarlet Cord also says:
EarningsThe girls will not reveal to whom they give the money. We know that they can make about €500 per night. Those who work for a “loverboy” cannot keep any money for themselves. Those who work for a pimp from Eastern Europe pay about 75 percent to the pimp and keep the rest. I met a girl from Greece who was trafficked by an Albanian man. She made €60,000 for him in one year. She was 17 when she started to work with a fake passport. This information came from a brothel owner. Dutch and East European prostitutes have tattoos with the names of their pimps. This makes it a bit easier for the police, but the pimps don’t realize that. The African girls start off with a debt of €40,000; if she pays that back, she is “free.”

If you calculate that those 237 women all pay €125 per day for a room, and earn about €500 of which, based on evidence, little if any of it is kept by the woman or legally filed for tax purposes. That’s €625 total a day, €3125 per week, a little over €1 million in one year, just from one girl.

Recruitment and Transportation
We obtained information about recruitment from the Dutch and the South Americans and a little bit from the East Europeans, but that was complicated by language difficulties. South American women come to Holland by plane or train through Spain. The average age is over 40. Most of these women have been here for many years, have their Dutch papers and work to keep up their financial needs. Some ladies are over the age of 60.

Africans come by plane most of the time via Western Europe. They fly into Germany and take a train or plane into Amsterdam or Belgium. Most of them work on fake passports. They are a closed group. They like to pray and want to have books and bibles, but will never tell their stories. East European girls are also closed and don’t dare tell their stories to the police. Most of the Dutch girls have come by way of pimps, so-called “loverboys.”

Conditions
Most girls live in apartments owned by the traffickers with connections in Amsterdam. Most African girls live in the Bijlmermeer. As long as the girl has a pimp she is not free to come and go. You can see that with the Dutch girls, you see them walking with their “protectors”, but the Africans don’t have “protection” around them and they are afraid. The South Americans are free to come and go. But what is freedom if your whole family is relying on your income? These women are always under pressure from their family, parents, or children to provide financially. One woman told me that she resembles a terrorist because she sacrifices her life for her family.
The report also contains interviews with (former) prostitutes in the Netherlands, the Shared Hope group also made field observations in the Netherlands itself. Very interesting.

While I was reading through the report I felt some kind of déjà vu. I really thought; haven't I read this somewhere before? Anyway...... this really makes clear there's a real translation problem with respect to prostitution documentation. You can find tons of literature in the Dutch libraries, but only the people who have that special gift of being able to read Dutch can understand its content. This makes it extremely difficult for outsiders to study prostitution in the Netherlands. Same thing goes for other non-English speaking countries. I propose that (feminist) activists throughout the world translate all the material for free. I will cost a lot of man-hours, but some documents are really too important to overlook (just a hunch anyway).

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Saturday, September 06, 2008

Sneep

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Some highlights from the 'Schone Schijn' report. Translated, so that all the non-Dutch people can read and weep too!!!!

You can read the report 'Schone Schijn' over here:

(the webpage of the OM)
http://www.om.nl/onderwerpen/mensenhandel_en/@148766/de_signalering_van/

(the pdf-file)
http://www.om.nl/publish/pages/98059/klpd_sneep_low_res_tcm5-968601.pdf

Note that respondent 34 can be nobody other than Toos Heemskerk of the Scharlaken Koord (Scarlet Cord).

Also note that the writers extensively use the square brackets (I mean [ and ]) like I do, that's why this time I use curly brackets ({ and }) instead if I want to give comments.

Page 34:
In 2007 the analysts of the Sneep project had insight in possibly 120 victims around the network of the brothers Dürdan, of whom 78 supposed victims (see also extent, §3.6, and methods, §4.7.1). Of the 120 prostitutes there were many from Germany (36) and the Netherlands (25). In total 73 women (65%) from ‘the old EU-member states’, twenty (17%) from the member states who joined in 2005 and eleven (9%) from the member states who joined in 2007. Six women (5%) were not born in a country that is a member of the European Union. Of ten women no country of birth was known.

(…)

Probably the women are already working in prostitution before they become part of the group Dürdan. From the information of the Sneep project there are no (supposed) victims known who did not know in advance that they would be working as a prostitute. There are several ways in which prostitutes are incorporated into the group. Mostly the prostitutes are ‘snatched’ from other pimps. Usually a prostitute is persuaded to voluntarily ‘move over’. Four women reported to the police that they were intimidated by the group. Group members stood in front of the door of these women and kept clients away. The prostitutes had a strong feeling that is was the intention that they had to work for the organization.
Page 35:
very scared
A is being called by B. B forgot to say to A that he couldn’t come this evening because his girl isn’t going to work today. A says that the girl of B was becoming cocky because she doesn’t call his girl anymore. “That is not allowed”, says B, “she could be cocky towards me but not towards them because they are her girlfriends. Although she’s cocky, what the fuck (…) {(…) in original text}. She knows that her life could become in danger then, she knows well enough that you will kill her then. The girl is very frightened of you.”

Like a little lamb
A telephone conversation between two suspects. The girl of one of them wants to spend money on clothes. The other advises him that he mustn’t let his girl do too exuberant purchases.
A: “You must sometimes say no.. I say it, sometimes you must grab them by the throat.. like grab them by the hair.. and say like I will fuck you, will do something to you and look you into the eyes and throw {them} away… that will be enough for her… I don’t lie.... I swear to you.. last time we had a quarrel and I battered her very badly, I battered her a bit. She is now like a little lamb…
-B: “She is now a pussycat and sits in the corner….

Earn more
Suspect A call suspect B. B tells that his girl is asleep now and that she has cried. “How much has that one of you earned?” asks A. “A little”, says B.
A: “Enough to pay the rent?
B: “No
A: “How much did she earn yesterday?
B: “Five hundred
A: “Say to her that you will arrange that she will get silicones and stuff like that, so she will earn a thousand a day. She will get silicones and we will make her hair in order.
Page 39:
3.8. Current state of affairs

The first arrests of the Sneep project were done in February 2007. 28 suspects in total were apprehended. One of the suspects also was a victim. Aside from that three suspects were already detained and one suspect was subject in an investigation. During the interrogation period two victims have been apprehended due to perjury.
As of January 2008 eights suspects are still in preventive custody. These are the suspects who were regarded as pimps by the research team. The bodyguards have been released in the meantime. Apart from that all the suspects who have come into view will be prosecuted wherever possible. (…)

Fifteen victims have reported the crime to the police or made an incriminating statement. Most victims still work in window prostitution. Also the bodyguards are working again in the window prostitution areas.
Page 72:
Multiple respondents told us that some brothel operators aside from renting out windows, also provided accommodation to prostitutes while asking an exorbitant rent (Respondents 5 & 6). First of all this is reminiscent to the dependent position which is typical of the offence of human trafficking. Second of all this raises the question if a brothel owner commits human trafficking in the sense of article 273f Sr when he provides accommodation to victims of human trafficking: art 273 lid 1 Sub 1 Sr after all implicitly names ‘providing accommodation’. The brothel owner is with the knowledge of the crime guilty of human trafficking anyway: by renting out windows he willingly and knowingly takes advantage of the exploitive situation.

7.5.2 Case Dürdan

A window landlord from one of the cities where the Dürdan group was active, has requested in the spring of 2005 a consultation with the department of Commercial Vice of the local police. He was worried about “German Turks” in the prostitution area where he rented out work chambers. Of some other operators of window leasing companies it might be assumed that they were aware of the fact that their female renters work for a pimp, but no other brothel operator made a formal report of this to the police.

Some window landlords explicitly state that they only hold contact with prostitutes; others also do business with pimps. From the telephone conversation given below between two main suspects it can be deducted that the window landlord involved only wants to talk with the prostitutes themselves. On the other hand the conversation makes clear that the landlord is informed about the fact that there are third persons who have a businesslike interest in the activities of the female renter.
Page 73:
A. is called by B. He asks if Jackie is a girl belonging to them. When A. confirms this, B. tells that their own girl from C, is expelled out of her own room in [X] and he heard that the girl next to her, Jackie, was also supposedly expelled out of the room. B. explains that he phoned to the office to ask for an explanation, but they didn’t want to tell him anything, because they only wanted to talk to the girls themselves. But they did tell that the police came. B. Says that he wants to throw in the windows of all the rooms. A. will find out what has happened and will call B. back.

From the following passage it becomes clear that the window landlord is doing business with the pimps of the group. The Dürdan group in this municipality always uses the same workspaces. The following conversation between A. and John, a window landlord, illustrates this. The window is rented out to a woman who works for John. A. tries to reverse this.

A: ”But John, you do know, we have always…this [workplace] is only for us”

A. doesn’t succeed in getting the room and a couple of days later he tries again under the name Halit. John doesn’t seem to recognize the voice of A. and then went on to call him Halit. A. says that he is on this [location] for fifteen years. Also this conversation doesn’t yield the right result. John proposes that ‘Halit’ comes to his office. According to the criminal investigation teams of the Project Sneep multiple telephone calls have been made which point at direct contact between (co-workers of) window landlords and the suspects. From this it turns out that landlords are informed with the fact that they are dealing with pimps. In the following fragment the group is searching for living accommodation:

A. makes a call with the brothel operator and asks if he has a little apartment for two girls who come to [municipality X]. He doesn’t have that. A. is referred to a man whom is specified by the brothel operator as ‘my brother’.


On the yearly expenses of window leasing company Y was a deduction of 500.000 euro under the title ‘commission’. An audit that the tax department started after this and a conversation with the manager of this company learned that this was about protection money. To whom this was paid, the manager didn’t want to tell.
Page 75:
Some inspectors ask for the identification card during the inspection and have a chat to win the trust of the prostitute (Respondent 17), others focus mainly towards the validity of the papers. Some inspectors make the certificate of registration at the Chamber of Commerce and a sofi-number {~National Insurance Number} obligatory, others ask only for a passport (Respondent 12). Some inspectors aside from inspections also pay attention to loitering pimps or persons in expensive cars. Two of them indicated that it is important to be present in the prostitution zone in order to see what’s happening (Respondent 10 & 11). During the accompaniment with the prostitution inspections in turned out that they were talking with bodyguards and pimps. The suspects didn’t give the impression that they wanted to conceil their activities from the policemen. One of them even complained about a group member. In one municipality the prostitution inspections are not always planned. It is then tried to inspect an as large as possible area. During the inspections one also looks out for possible bodyguards and pimps. Outside of that {prostitution area}, as far as is known, not.
Page 76:
A number of the interviewed inspectors or vice detectives find it difficult to give a reliable estimate of the percentage of prostitutes that work under force (Respondent 14). Others did dare to make an estimate. Estimates named of the percentage of women whom are forced and/or exploited, are 50% (Respondents 22 & 23), 60% (Respondent 17), 70% (Respondent 10 & 11) and 65-85% (Respondent 9).
Page 78:
Eva and Pavlina want to work in Z. A. brought them there, but didn’t want to be seen with them in the street. “He said to us that he first wanted to walk into the street together with B. We weren’t allowed to walk near him. We had to walk a distance behind him and do as if we didn’t belong to them. We did have to keep an eye on them. A. was supposed to stand before a door of a window prostitution building. This would be a sign for us that we should go inside there to ask if we could work there. And so it happened that way. This later turned out to be property X. In the building we first had to wait until the police had inspected us. After this we went to work.”
Page 79:
Except for the window landlords, the police is probably the most often present in the prostitution zone. They capture the most signals of trafficking in women and estimate the percentage of involuntarily working prostitutes to be high. These signals are not always very concrete though. Often these are also ‘underbelly feelings’ of the vice detectives and it’s difficult for them to lay their finger on it. Especially when the victims in question don’t want to be identified as such. The problem is that the short moments of contact during the inspection often yield few signals with a so-called ‘investigation indication’. The papers which are inspected are mostly in order. This doesn’t guarantee voluntariness on the side of the prostitute however.
Possibly that ‘hanging around’ in the prostitution areas will yield more concrete signals. Also then the question remains why so few investigations result from so many signals (see also chapter 10).

(…)

In two of the three municipalities the social workers are positive about the cooperation with the police (Respondents 34, 35, 36 & 37), although more capacity at the police to deal with loitering pimps would be welcome (Respondent 35). One of them would also like to see that the municipality involves the brothels owners more in countering human trafficking (Respondent 34). This way it could be made compulsory that in every room in multiple languages there would be a notice board on the door with a telephone number for girls who are under force or want to leave. At this moment prostitutes don’t always know how they have to make known that they need help. One girl who wanted to step out, told her that she had tried to draw the attention from the police at the moment her pimp wasn’t there. The policemen however waved back unsuspectingly. (Respondent 34).
Page 80:
In the third municipality there’s according to the interviewed social workers no cooperation with the police. “Brothel owners keep matters better under control [in the prostitution zone] than the police”. When there are problems with a pimp they call in the help of the brothel operators (Respondents 38 & 63).
Not all social workers can make judgements about the extent to which force takes place in prostitution zones. Sometimes it happens that prostitutes are forced for years and only tell that afterwards. “The barrier to work in prostitution is high, but the barrier to leave is even higher” (Respondent 37). “[On a tippelzone] there was for instance a cheerful, sociable girl. After three years it turned out the she was violently pimped” (Respondent 37). One of the social workers thinks that many women [in the prostitution zone in the city where she works] are one way or another under control of a pimp. She also adds that at the moment many Hungarian women work there who are often in a bad condition. “Some don’t know in which country they are. Some work for way too low prices and without a condom” (Respondent 38). Another female social worker estimates that approximately one half of the women enters prostitution (by way of relationships in) the criminal scene. The majority of the Eastern European women ‘enters with an individual who arranges everything’ (Respondent 34). Among these young Eastern European women furthermore the turnover is large because their pimp constantly puts them to work in different places (Respondent 35). The Dürdan group by the way is not a very good example of this so-called ‘prostitution-carrousel’: most girls constantly work(ed) in the same city and often even behind the same window.

(…)

Social workers probably have a reasonable insight into the fact if the women whom they have contact with are working voluntarily or not. One problem with this is that many victims probably talk with the social workers on the condition that their secret is safe. When social workers share too many signals with the police, the position of trust with their clients becomes damaged and no signals will come in again. Nonetheless the police and social workers do share information to a certain extent.
Page 86 {a bodyguard explains after his arrest}:
Question: “Can you tell something about the girls whom you know [in a certain prostitution zone]?”
A: There exist [x number of] windows [in this prostitution zone]. From the smallest to the largest brick I know everyone and everything. I don’t know a lot about the girls. I don’t know their real names. Sometimes I was favoured by the police [in the prostitution zone]. I don’t work for the police. I did have good contact with the police. I always mediated when there where problems. I didn’t have fixed windows where I kept an eye on. The four women about whom I talked earlier did have fixed addresses” (interrogation, Sneep File).


Two interviewed prostitution inspectors indeed had ‘good contact’ with the bodyguards or pimps and the brothel operators (or managers). By one of the brothel operators they were invited to a new year party, by one of the prostitutes to her wedding (Respondents 10 & 11). The question arises if such a tight contact doesn’t hinder the inspection activities.
Page 87 {a victim of forced prostitution said:}
“When I see [prostitution inspectors] shake hands with pimps or [see] them throw an arm around them, and when I see [prostitution inspectors] drink coffee with the brothel operators, I have the feeling I can’t say anything anymore” (Respondent 61).
Page 92:
Starting from April 2007 30 supposed victims of the Dürdan group were approached. Seventeen of them stated that they didn’t feel victims of human trafficking. Five women didn’t want or dare to make a statement. Three women made an incriminating statement. Five women reported the crime of human trafficking to the police, but later three of them wanted to withdraw it again. A number of these reports had already been done before to start of the investigation. (see also Chapter Ten about the cause of the unresponsiveness of these women.)
Page 93:
Also foreign women don’t see themselves necessarily as victim. Some in the country of origin entered into a contract that after arrival in the Netherlands turned out be unjust. A wage of 15 euro per hour perhaps is a lot in the country of birth, but in prostitution in the Netherlands that is a mere pittance by comparison. Nevertheless they themselves agreed {into that} (Respondent 37). In the governmental report of an investigation into human trafficking (Donar) this is confirmed:

From the research it turned out that the willingness of the women to report the crime is low. It is striking that this cannot always be blamed to fear of reprisals, but can also be explained by a difference of opinion about norms and values. In our eyes the women are exploited and abused, but not all women experience it that way. That is because the (financial) position in Bulgaria is often very bad and they earn in the Netherlands a lot more money than they would in their own country. Even when most of the money goes to the human trafficker (Donar, 2001:12) {Kernteam Noord en Oost Nederland (2001). Rapportage naar aanleiding van het Donar recherche onderzoek.}

From a research in 2001 among prostitutes in Amsterdam it turned out that many Eastern European women found it to be normal to pay a pimp or to enter into a contract with an agency. For that reason they saw no reason to report the crime. Moreover they didn’t see themselves as victims, but on the contrary as survivors:
Page 93-94:
Of course we know the men of that agency are taking advantage of us; we must pay a lot of money, but we knew what the contract was about”. We are all happy to stop working in this job once our debts have been paid, but we will not go back to Belarus. Although we are well-educated, there is no employment for us at home. […] The men in my village are also unemployed., they drink to much and they abuse their wives and children. We will find a nice man here so that we can stay; we are survivors” -Lisa, 22 (GG&GD Amsterdam, 2005:7) {GG&GD Amsterdam (2005). Intermediary project for prostitutes. Annual report 2002-2004.} {not translated! Originally in English}
Page 94:
Third of all victims are difficult to be recognized based on physical features alone. In the case Dürdan two women were under pressure to earn a high target sum per day. A cheerful and provocative prostitute attracts most clients, so paradoxically enough exactly these victims looked like ‘happy hookers’. Generally during the inspections prostitutes are being talked to for a couple of minutes. Assuming the above-mentioned {happy hookers-like victims} it is unlikely that a victim at a certain moment will make clear towards an inspector that she is being forced. Victims will do everything to appear to be there voluntarily. The fact that women are being monitored by pimps and bodyguards, makes a victim testimony even more unlikely. As it happens, policemen must legitimize themselves when they inspect a prostitute. “When a pimp sees that, then you immediately try to remove them [prostitution inspectors] to outside as quickly as possible”, according to a victim. (Respondent 56). The same victim remarked that prostitution inspectors often had the tendency to step inside

as if they were pimps themselves; as if they know what it’s all about in this world. They just should behave normally. They often come in as if they are so tough. That doesn’t really invite {you} to talk (Respondent 56).

A second respondent whom we spoke with, had the same impression (Respondent 62). Also the social workers of the Foundation Against Trafficking in Women have the impression that the women don’t have a need for ‘a chat with the police’, but they want the police to aim towards the pimps (Respondent 57).
Page 107:
How strong the loyalty towards the perpetrators is, turns out from the fact that two victims – despite that they have been apprehended for perjury – keep on maintaining that they work voluntarily and allowed to keep the money for themselves. The team confronted the victims with telephone conversations from which is turns out that the women don’t decide the working hours themselves, are not allowed themselves to decide who their clients are or must earn a minimum of 1000 euro per night. One of the two states as follows:

Sarah: “I really do it voluntarily. I don’t understand the problem. I already did this work a year before I got to know A. I work six days a week now. If I can get it in order, I do work seven days because I have to do everything now A isn’t here anymore. I have to go out shopping and cleaning and take the dog out. During the last months I have a lot of stress since A is apprehended. […]”
Policeman: “I had hoped that when you wouldn’t be under pressure of A., you would stand up for yourself. Now I have to confront you with lies and that I find a pity. I know that you didn’t tell those lies to improve your own situation but you told them under pressure. Or am I wrong?”
Sarah: “I don’t want to give an answer. I have answered enough questions. I’m not under pressure. I’m only under pressure from you because you keep on coming with these telephone conversations.”
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